Conflict resolution and relational dynamics
Date: 2025-10-31
Summary
Two speakers discuss strategies for conflict resolution and creating safety in their relationship, especially during travel. They explore how to manage and articulate personal responses to triggers and conflicts. One speaker emphasizes the need for retreating into a personal space ("cave") to process emotions like rage, aiming for a more understanding and compassionate dialogue afterward. The other stresses the importance of communicating needs and the challenges of perceiving hostility, which can dysregulate their nervous system. They discuss past incidents of miscommunication, feeling shut out, and aiming for a balance between needing space and reconnecting. Both express a desire to improve their conflict handling, with one noting that anger isn't just directed at the partner but at themselves and the situation too. They agree on giving each other 30 minutes of space during conflicts and recognize the importance of external support systems. The conversation concludes with mutual affection and an understanding of each other's needs for assurance and validation while working through their personal triggers.
Main points
- Discussion on relational repair and creating safety during conflicts.
- Creation of a safety plan for handling conflicts during a trip to Peru.
- Instances where one person seeks retreat to process emotions.
- Need for understanding and trust in letting a partner 'go into their cave'.
- Importance of processing emotions without lashing out.
- Differing needs for space and reassurance during conflicts.
- Impacts of perceived emotional dumping and reaction to it.
- Acknowledgment of intense past experiences and their residual effects.
- Recognition of instances where previous agreements were violated.
- Discussion of possible emotional framings like perceived villainy vs. team mindset in conflicts.
- Shared experience of how time and space can aid in processing conflicts.
- Understanding each individual’s need for emotional processing outside the relationship.
- Recognition of shared steps towards healing and improved conflict navigation.
- Discussion of physical space needs during emotionally charged situations.
- Acknowledgment of navigating self-care and shared care during emotional dysregulation.
Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker 1: Okay. So, we're talking about, uh, relational stuff repair. Uh, how to create safety, I guess, when we're gonna-
[00:00:10] Speaker 2: I guess.
[00:00:10] Speaker 1: ... go traveling.
[00:00:11] Speaker 2: "I guess," he says. Hmm.
[00:00:14] Speaker 1: Help me fix that. So not "I guess." Like...
[00:00:18] Speaker 2: We are going to create a safety plan in terms of times of conflict when people need different things while we're in Peru, and set ourself up for success and rewire these ways of responding to each other in times of crisis and trigger.
[00:00:36] Speaker 1: Okay, cool. So yeah, let's start talking. So, what, what did you wanna, like, write about or share about?
[00:00:43] Speaker 2: Hmm. I mean, I feel like if we're looking at the classic occurrence of what happened these last couple weeks, there was a few instances, and let's take the last one for example of the... Something comes up. You begin to have an experience. I don't fully understand what's going on. You start to go into your cave. I still don't fully understand what's going on, and as you're starting to retreat into your cave, I'm already trying to pull you out of your cave, of how we might navigate this when it comes up next time. When, like, a trigger arises for someone, and the thing that I'm sitting with, it's like, in a situation like that, am I able to just go, "Ish is having his experience, and I'm here, and I'm steady, and I'm gonna actually take care of myself, and I'm gonna trust that he'll return because we always return." Instead of going into crisis panic, which is what oftentimes happens in my own nervous system, and what that might look like for reassurance, what that might look like in terms of, like, time, what that might look like if we're needing outside support. So, I feel like those are a few pieces that come up for me.
[00:02:08] Speaker 1: Yeah. I think this is, this is, this is a good time because now I'm remembering the reason why I feel so bad about that thing of, like, you dumping your shit on me.
[00:02:21] Speaker 2: Hmm.
[00:02:21] Speaker 1: That's... And then the reaction, the r- reaction that came out of you after, justifiably so, that's exactly why I need to go to my, into my cave. Because when I can go into my cave, what happens is I can, like, take all those things and all the feelings I'm feeling, 'cause there's some rage, you know?
[00:02:39] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:02:39] Speaker 1: Like, the rage, and... But it's not fully justified. Like, I'm feeling the rage, and yet my immediate thing is like, "Fuck your shit. Like, I know you're having your own stuff come up." Like, because I know you have shared your history, so in my head I'm thinking of all of that. I'm like, "Obviously you're having this thing, and it's not about my thing only, it's about all these other things." And I'm trying to, like, kind of put things in order so that when I'm sharing, I can share from a place of holistic understanding. That's why I need to go into my cave, so I can process, and I don't just lash out at you, because if I am not processing, like, your want- you want connection, and right away my immediate reaction is to pull back, like just 100,000-fold.
[00:03:28] Speaker 2: Hmm. Mm-hmm.
[00:03:28] Speaker 1: But me going to my cave, and yeah, I'm still pulled back, but I'm pulled back in like, less of a charged way. It's more like I have a, I feel sad and I feel misunderstood as opposed to, like, "Fuck you." Like, "I hate you." Like, you know, "You don't," like, "You don't deserve any of this." Like, it's a whole different way that is, like, more red of what happens when I'm immed- in that immediate point of contraction.
[00:03:49] Speaker 2: Hmm.
[00:03:49] Speaker 1: But if I can go into my own space, I can play out th- all the things that happened, find compassion for myself, find compassion for you, find compassion for the situation, and I can come back with an open heart-
[00:04:02] Speaker 2: Hmm.
[00:04:03] Speaker 1: ... and have a dialogue that feels more fruitful.
[00:04:07] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:04:08] Speaker 1: And... Yeah. And I think m- really the best thing, (sighs) and it really depends on the severity of the experience. Like, last time was probably the strongest one, where I had such a strong reaction, and at that time, the best thing isn't probably for you to be like, "Okay, like, are you able to, like, reconnect? Can you give me assurance?" Like, I just need some time. Like, assurance, for me, it's like I'm not... My immediate reaction is not to be like, "Oh, we're done." It's more like, "I just need some time from all of this shit so I can come back." So, I think that assurance is already implied, but when, like, it's been asked in that moment of, like, me con- like, being so pulled back, my immediate reaction is like, "You're not fucking getting it. I am just needing my own space and my own time and my own bubble." Like, "Get the fuck away." Then it becomes even stronger of a thing.
[00:04:59] Speaker 2: Hmm.
[00:05:00] Speaker 1: And I think, yeah, so in that point, what I can do better is coming back and giving you some assurance quicker than I- what I do now. And what would help me is for you to have that understanding that I'm just in my own cave, like, literally like a robot, trying to, like, parse the whole thing out, putting the different stories that are happening in my head into order so I can see the whole thing in a more, like, loving lens and compassionate lens, as opposed to the immediate thing, which is like, "Oh, like, this woman doesn't get me."
[00:05:31] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:05:31] Speaker 1: "She doesn't understand any of the things I'm feeling. She's already w- she said a bunch of stuff to me, and now she's wanting assurance from me." It's like, like, it feels like, for me, in my head it feels like almost like emotional abuse. Like, "You just told me, like, I'm a piece of shit, and now you want me to tell you that, like, you're loved or tell..." So, that's how I see it.
[00:05:50] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Do you feel, 'cause that's like I become the villain, do you feel in this situation like there can be, like, a softening where I still know we're on the same team? Or that there's like, "Hey, I'm feeling really fucking..."... triggered and pissed off at you, and I'm noticing I need to go into my cave, and I'll be back. I need to tend to myself. Like it-
[00:06:14] Speaker 1: Yeah. So that's-
[00:06:15] Speaker 2: 'Cause that's-
[00:06:16] Speaker 1: ... if-
[00:06:16] Speaker 2: That is what helps me to actually be able to go-
[00:06:20] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:06:20] Speaker 2: ... "Okay. I can give you space now. He's going through it."
[00:06:23] Speaker 1: Mm-hmm.
[00:06:23] Speaker 2: But I think what happens when it's like, there is like, "Fuck you," it's so, like, I'm just curious if like, where is that place-
[00:06:31] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:06:31] Speaker 2: ... where we can like both feel, and where you're not aban- I'm not saying like, "Now you're holding me and everything's fine."
[00:06:37] Speaker 1: Right. Like-
[00:06:38] Speaker 2: But it's like-
[00:06:38] Speaker 1: ... last time, what happened was, like, this whole thing happened and I pulled back, and you were like, "Can you, can you give me a hug?" I'm like, "No, I can't." And I, you know?
[00:06:47] Speaker 2: And, and I think this one was complex too though, because-
[00:06:49] Speaker 1: This one was, yeah, more complex.
[00:06:49] Speaker 2: ... you had been holding space for me, so I was feeling really vulnerable.
[00:06:52] Speaker 1: Yeah. Right. 'Cause yeah.
[00:06:53] Speaker 2: And then I had also felt like, "What the fuck just happened there?"
[00:06:56] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:06:56] Speaker 2: So this was also a complex one for what was coming up for me there because it wasn't your normal like, "Okay, he's pulling away, I'm triggered."
[00:07:02] Speaker 1: Right.
[00:07:02] Speaker 2: It was like I was having this vulnerable experience, and now this person who was holding me has fully shut me out.
[00:07:08] Speaker 1: Yeah, so I think if we take this out, then I feel like we've actually not be- I feel like then we have been kind of working the way, we have been g- gradually evolving in a better way of connecting from last year to like even the last time it happened.
[00:07:21] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:07:21] Speaker 1: Like I think, you know, I am able to give you assurance now. If we take out this past instance-
[00:07:26] Speaker 2: And-
[00:07:27] Speaker 1: And I feel like there is-
[00:07:28] Speaker 2: I feel like Victoria felt very intense for me.
[00:07:31] Speaker 1: Yeah, I think Victoria felt very intense for me too but I think we moved through it. I feel like-
[00:07:39] Speaker 2: But I-
[00:07:39] Speaker 1: We played and stuff.
[00:07:41] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[00:07:41] Speaker 1: And then it was hard, and I definitely, I think that charge was kind of present.
[00:07:46] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:07:46] Speaker 1: But, and that we had, we kinda, we kinda had a conversation, "Yeah, sure." I think let's talk about Victoria then.
[00:07:52] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[00:07:52] Speaker 1: Like, you know, that whole thing happened, we were playing around, and for some, I think like I felt like that that was a violation of an agreement.
[00:07:59] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:08:00] Speaker 1: Or, because, you know, that you came up with. And I think what happened for me was, yeah, it, it was like a s- sign of disrespect. And it's interesting because this whole thing of the trust that came up last time-
[00:08:15] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:08:15] Speaker 1: I connected all of that with the, you know, and then I'm like, "Oh, that's why." 'Cause I've like, again-
[00:08:20] Speaker 2: That's why it wouldn't-
[00:08:20] Speaker 1: ... all the trainings I've done, it's like, "Oh, obviously, you know, I'm the dom, she's the sub, but she's slapping me out in public 'cause clearly she doesn't trust me. She sees me as her inferior, she sees me as like all this-"
[00:08:32] Speaker 2: Yeah, you-
[00:08:32] Speaker 1: ... like negative self-talk, yeah.
[00:08:33] Speaker 2: ... you go into stories that aren't true.
[00:08:34] Speaker 1: And now it makes sense because for the last two months, she's been holding onto this thing of not being able to trust me. So yeah, like all, and she just, she just worked with me because, you know, like I can create safety for her in these different ways.
[00:08:47] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:08:47] Speaker 1: But there's like actual no, like, love. And she's only-
[00:08:52] Speaker 2: Oh, you're really going down there.
[00:08:52] Speaker 1: ... with me because like, yeah, like, you know-
[00:08:54] Speaker 2: Holy fuck.
[00:08:55] Speaker 1: ... of the, of the safety and the protection-
[00:08:57] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:08:57] Speaker 1: ... and the security.
[00:08:58] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:08:59] Speaker 1: So it's like, yeah.
[00:09:00] Speaker 2: I'm, I'm curious in, just in terms of like... Instead of framing it as, like, this is emotional abuse when she's asking for reassurance, it's like, oh, this is my partner's nervous system, and I also... Like, I feel like when I've been in super triggers, remember that one time I needed space from you after Woodshed?
[00:09:23] Speaker 1: Yep.
[00:09:24] Speaker 2: But I was also able to be like, "Hey, I wanna take space."
[00:09:28] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:09:28] Speaker 2: And I know we operate differently-
[00:09:29] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:09:29] Speaker 2: ... and there's like this subconscious experience of what our nervous systems-
[00:09:33] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:09:33] Speaker 2: ... will just automatically do.
[00:09:34] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:09:34] Speaker 2: But like, is there anything before I take space where I could offer you, like, is there something that you're needing right now and you had asked to stay the night? And I'm not saying it needs to be to that extreme.
[00:09:46] Speaker 1: Asked, I had asked to stay the night?
[00:09:48] Speaker 2: You wanted to spend one night together before we took space.
[00:09:51] Speaker 1: At the w-
[00:09:52] Speaker 2: At, at my place.
[00:09:53] Speaker 1: After Woodstove.
[00:09:53] Speaker 2: After Woodstove.
[00:09:53] Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. Right.
[00:09:56] Speaker 2: You know? And, and had I been like, "Ish, hurt me so much," and like-
[00:10:01] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:10:02] Speaker 2: ... I'm, I'm just curious. And a- again, I know that this is like way deeper than this conversation, but I'm just curious if like we're able to reframe this person is a villain and I need to protect myself-
[00:10:12] Speaker 1: Right.
[00:10:12] Speaker 2: ... to like, okay, we are a team. One of us has caused the other pain. What do we need to do to have a point of connection before we take space if that's what's needed?
[00:10:21] Speaker 1: So what happened with the Woodstove situation is for a couple of nights we were in like a conflict, but then that day, we moved through a lot of stuff. We were at the beach, we went to another place in the water, we found salmon-
[00:10:34] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:10:34] Speaker 1: ... we went to a restaurant.
[00:10:35] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:10:35] Speaker 1: So by the time that request came up-
[00:10:38] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[00:10:38] Speaker 1: ... we had moved through it and like-
[00:10:40] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:10:40] Speaker 1: ... we had found like an easier ground.
[00:10:42] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[00:10:42] Speaker 1: And I need that easier ground-
[00:10:44] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:10:44] Speaker 1: ... to like able to like, you know, then be more open it.
[00:10:47] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:10:47] Speaker 1: That's when I think this last time, I didn't have that little bit of a space from the conflict to like want-
[00:10:56] Speaker 2: Yeah, 'cause we went to the sweat lodge together and-
[00:10:58] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:10:58] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:10:58] Speaker 1: And I think I said like, "Okay, let's check in after this." Because you asked me-
[00:11:02] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:11:02] Speaker 1: ... and I'm like, and I did say like, "Let's check in after the sweat lodge."
[00:11:06] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:11:06] Speaker 1: And like, but like that, I think for me, like that spaciousness is just to breathe a little bit feels better. And I, even like I could, I realize like at the sweat lodge, you know, you were like coming, we're still kind of like in this thing, and I was like, "Oh God, I feel like I need to like, you know, kind of tend to you." And then I, again, I'm getting taken away from my experience. And as far as what to do, just a little bit of space. Like if, like for example, what, what happened that day, and I know this is like a very, like strong anomaly, so we're not all, we're not gonna always have that thing, but that was a very like particularly extreme experience.
[00:11:50] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:11:51] Speaker 1: Um, but if you play it back, "I'm with you. I'm with you. I'm with you," then you're sharing something that ha- that, that happened, uh, with you regarding me, and you were holding onto it for two months or so, um, that I'm like feeling, "Oh my God, I can't. Like this woman who, you know, values so much trust and transparency has been hiding this thing from me, and she's also making this whole thing into this, another thing, and I'm feeling like closed off."... and the move there, uh, would be to just be in that space of mock.
[00:12:26] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:12:26] Speaker 1: Like, you know, man, instead of coming to me right away, and I think, like, I do appreciate you coming in and you, like, initiating the connection or just ch- checking in. But just a little bit of space because even a change of scenery, like, we were in the same room the whole time-
[00:12:39] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:12:39] Speaker 1: ... like, it happened and I'm there and then I'm, like, trying to stage the space, you know, like, "Can you hold me?" Eh.
[00:12:44] Speaker 2: Well, I, 'cause at this point too, though, you haven't-
[00:12:46] Speaker 1: This is a very extreme experience.
[00:12:47] Speaker 2: ... you, but you also haven't fully articulated the spot. What you said fucking hurt and I need some space. So I'm just like, it's an energy and when your-
[00:12:55] Speaker 1: Right.
[00:12:55] Speaker 2: ... energy shifts, I go into fucking panic.
[00:12:58] Speaker 1: It's because, like, I knew that, you know, like, I was doing work on you and I knew that I kind of opened it up and I think Nick articulated it yesterday and I, and I didn't want to, like, as, like, a provider of some body services, I was gonna be like, you know?
[00:13:12] Speaker 2: (laughs) Like, "I'm still in session but I'm fucking triggered." (laughs)
[00:13:14] Speaker 1: Yeah, ex- that's exactly... I'm like, I can't, like, if she's one of my coaches or patients, I can't be just telling them to, "Hey, you fucking did this whole thing-"
[00:13:20] Speaker 2: Yeah, but it-
[00:13:20] Speaker 1: ... and that's affecting me."
[00:13:22] Speaker 2: But I think what was happening is in your energy field-
[00:13:24] Speaker 1: You feel that. Totally.
[00:13:25] Speaker 2: ... and I think this is what I'm learning-
[00:13:26] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:13:26] Speaker 2: ... in the conflict with you, it's like-
[00:13:29] Speaker 1: And I feel the same way with you, where- where we are body-
[00:13:31] Speaker 2: ... you, you, when you're fucking angry at me, the energy that I feel (laughs) from you towards me is, like, hostility.
[00:13:38] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:13:38] Speaker 2: And it's so intense that my body... And, uh, you know, I'm like, I know again I need to work with my nervous system or I just need to go, like, "Mowgli, I love you and I see you're in experience you need some space. I'm gonna actually go for a walk and take care of myself." Instead of then trying to be here-
[00:13:54] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:13:55] Speaker 2: ... trying to connect.
[00:13:56] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:13:56] Speaker 2: Then I'm trying to co-regulate with you because I'm starting to feel dysregulated now that I'm like...
[00:14:01] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:14:01] Speaker 2: And so it's like-
[00:14:02] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:14:02] Speaker 2: And, and then I think what happens with me too is that-
[00:14:04] Speaker 1: There's the sauce.
[00:14:05] Speaker 2: ... I start to feel bad. I'm like, "Oh no, I've abandoned him."
[00:14:08] Speaker 1: Right. Yeah.
[00:14:09] Speaker 2: Instead of... And that's what was going on that night with Ben and Shea where it's like I wanted to be with you and I've had nights like this where I feel shut out where I'm just fucking shaking in bed all night and I don't sleep.
[00:14:18] Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
[00:14:18] Speaker 2: And so I tr- I think I'm also in this place of trying to figure out, like, when you get into this place, how do I love you and care for you and also fucking care for myself? Because I, I abandon myself sometimes.
[00:14:29] Speaker 1: Right.
[00:14:29] Speaker 2: And then I'm like, "I need to be here." And then I'm like, well now I'm still here, I'm getting more dysregulated and now I'm trying to seek soothing from you which is just causing you to go into your cave more.
[00:14:40] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:14:41] Speaker 2: So I'm, you know, like...
[00:14:41] Speaker 1: I think in that case...
[00:14:45] Speaker 2: Like when it's very strong.
[00:14:47] Speaker 1: Yeah, so that anger, like, you know, you're feeling this... What was the word you used?
[00:14:52] Speaker 2: Like hostility.
[00:14:53] Speaker 1: Hostility, yeah. I think I'm feeling hostile against everything and everyone. It's not... So maybe if that helps, like, I'm not just being hostile against you, I'm also probably being hostile against myself. I'm probably just being hostile in general. Um, and that's when, like, I need that space to just... And I, I think now we're kind- I'm kind of, like, you know, in circles.
[00:15:14] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
[00:15:15] Speaker 1: Because what's happening is, yeah, I know that what I'm feeling is not the full rational thing and I just need-
[00:15:21] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:15:21] Speaker 1: ... that space and time to just find my grounding a little bit.
[00:15:26] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:15:26] Speaker 1: So a little bit of change, I think this is something I can probably do too because I was just here trying to, like, kind of, I was pacing around trying to, like, hold you in because you were still there.
[00:15:37] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:15:37] Speaker 1: But I should have found a way to artfully exit the room. I think I just need to get out of, like, the same space that I was in. I need to get out of the bubble and find time. And I think, yeah, if l- maybe if this helps. Give me just at least half an hour. Like next time something like this is just-
[00:15:58] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[00:15:58] Speaker 1: Yeah, like half-
[00:15:59] Speaker 2: And I, and I feel-
[00:16:00] Speaker 1: 30 minutes?
[00:16:00] Speaker 2: And I feel like that's available for me.
[00:16:02] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:16:02] Speaker 2: But I think-
[00:16:03] Speaker 1: And then come check in after that because I-
[00:16:05] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[00:16:05] Speaker 1: ... still might be my thing, but 30, 30 minutes would help me just kind of come back to knowing better than that.
[00:16:09] Speaker 2: Yeah, I, I think that that's helpful for me and then for me to be like, okay, yeah. Ish, Ish needs to tend to himself and I'm having my own experience, and like, I'm gonna go take care of myself.
[00:16:19] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:16:19] Speaker 2: And not try to then co-regulate with you because I'm like, "That ain't no fucking bueno."
[00:16:25] Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:16:27] Speaker 2: You know? And then you're not in a place where you actually want that and then I'm... Yeah. Yeah, I'm just trying to navigate to, like, how to be with you in this process in a good way and also be like-
[00:16:39] Speaker 1: And it's-
[00:16:39] Speaker 2: I have needs that come up too in conflict of, like, connection and so it's like what is that balance between, like, you need your space and also like-
[00:16:46] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:16:46] Speaker 2: ... you might need to come back a little bit sooner than what you might want to do. You know? Like where is that, like...
[00:16:52] Speaker 1: Yeah, well I mean if-
[00:16:53] Speaker 2: Not the abandonment, but that.
[00:16:54] Speaker 1: My thing is I would be fucking gone for months. So you know, I'm, I've cut down from months to 30 minutes.
[00:17:00] Speaker 2: It's not always 30 minutes but we're working on 30 minutes. Yeah.
[00:17:02] Speaker 1: I'm still, I'm, yeah, I said, like, yeah, like I can do 30 minutes.
[00:17:05] Speaker 2: Yeah. Okay.
[00:17:05] Speaker 1: But the thing is, like, I haven't gotten the 30 minutes, you know? Sometimes I can ask-
[00:17:09] Speaker 2: At that point, yeah.
[00:17:10] Speaker 1: ... at some... Yeah. Um.
[00:17:11] Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah.
[00:17:11] Speaker 1: And-
[00:17:11] Speaker 2: I hear what you're saying.
[00:17:12] Speaker 1: Like-
[00:17:13] Speaker 2: And do we want, like, a word? Like, cave time? (laughs)
[00:17:15] Speaker 1: But I think when we're in that state-
[00:17:17] Speaker 2: You know, like-
[00:17:17] Speaker 1: ... like, it's hijacked now. I'm li-
[00:17:18] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:17:19] Speaker 1: I feel like just remembering 30 minutes, take 30. 30 minutes for both of us in that moment of conflict.
[00:17:25] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[00:17:25] Speaker 1: And I think you can survive for half an hour. Without-
[00:17:28] Speaker 2: 100%. And I can go do my own thing too.
[00:17:30] Speaker 1: Yeah. Right.
[00:17:30] Speaker 2: And I think it's like the more that I try to, like, be with you when you're in that place, then I just get more dysregulated. And so that's also working on my nervous system outside the relationship where it's like Ish-ish and like I'm here and, like, he's going through his experience and he'll come out. Then I go into it which I know is not helpful.
[00:17:49] Speaker 1: Right. Like in an ideal-
[00:17:51] Speaker 2: And that's the piece I need-
[00:17:51] Speaker 1: ... scenario like we would have, like, do all the repair and everything, like, right away. But look, I feel like today, like the thing that I wanted I got today, like two weeks after.
[00:18:01] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:18:01] Speaker 1: Right? And it's like it... And we had, like, one week of no- not a lot of connection, one week of repair.
[00:18:07] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:18:08] Speaker 1: Rupture, repair, repair. But I feel like, you know, but it's taken us two weeks even in that, in this state.
[00:18:12] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:18:12] Speaker 1: So sometimes things take time.
[00:18:15] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:18:15] Speaker 1: And I think what helps me to know is that...... you know, and the first sign of trouble, like, you're not gonna just, like, panic, run, or be like, oh, like, like, you know that ... You a- you, you can, like, resource yourself enough to know that, like, it can also just give me the assurance that I can't go through my own process. Because that's my other story, like, if I g- go into my own process of needing space or time, then you're gonna run or you're gonna need to go somewhere else or be with someone else because you can't handle me when I'm being in that contracted state or in my cave.
[00:18:45] Speaker 2: I think it's the hostility and what that evokes for my system. That I feel-
[00:18:50] Speaker 1: Yeah. Right.
[00:18:50] Speaker 2: ... or that, like... And then when you get... Y- you're in your own experience, but the way that I'm perceiving it is, like, cold.
[00:18:57] Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:18:57] Speaker 2: Or I'll feel like you're being mean or this.
[00:19:00] Speaker 1: Right. Yeah.
[00:19:00] Speaker 2: And it's like, yeah-
[00:19:02] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:19:02] Speaker 2: ... it just brings up things for me where I'm like-
[00:19:03] Speaker 1: Right.
[00:19:03] Speaker 2: ... "This is actually unbearable."
[00:19:05] Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
[00:19:05] Speaker 2: For my t- nervous system, when I get dysregulated then-
[00:19:09] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:19:09] Speaker 2: ... to be with you, and then I try to reg- like-
[00:19:13] Speaker 1: Yeah, and for me-
[00:19:14] Speaker 2: You know?
[00:19:14] Speaker 1: ... I have, like, that similar story too, where it's like, it's like, oh, it's like, you know, the young girl who's feeling so anxious, like a, the anxiety is, like, through the roof, and like, you're like-
[00:19:22] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:19:22] Speaker 1: ... you don't know where to go, like, it's like I need to, like, snap out of my shit to, like, be with you. And then I'm like, "Fuck, li- but I need to be in my thing-"
[00:19:29] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:19:29] Speaker 1: "... otherwise I can't fully move through this." So we both have, you know-
[00:19:32] Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the s-
[00:19:33] Speaker 1: ... these different versions of that same story.
[00:19:35] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
[00:19:35] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:19:35] Speaker 2: And it is the piece that we both need to work on. And I think that's where it's like, I know there's a lot of support in terms of resourcing my system that I need to tend to outside of this relationship, and, like, learning tools that actually feel accessible when I'm in it. And then it's also, yeah, like, how do we wanna implement those things in our own relationship in terms of conflict? Is it something... I think that we've, have done a lot of healing work around it, and I'm still noticing, I'm like, "Oh, yeah, like, this is still a pattern that we're working on." And what can we learn from what happened last time? Because I wanna be able to give you space too. So it's like, how to do it in a good way.
[00:20:14] Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, and I think that's where, like, having the individual support system, right-
[00:20:20] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:20:20] Speaker 1: ... knowing the people you can talk to-
[00:20:21] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:20:21] Speaker 1: ... we can both talk to-
[00:20:23] Speaker 2: Yeah.
[00:20:23] Speaker 1: ... um, helps. And having then also a community to, like, lean on.
[00:20:26] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:20:29] Speaker 1: How do you feel about that? Good?
[00:20:31] Speaker 2: Good enough, yeah.
[00:20:31] Speaker 1: Do you wanna add anything else?
[00:20:33] Speaker 2: Not right now. I feel complete.
[00:20:35] Speaker 1: I love you.
[00:20:36] Speaker 2: Love you too.
[00:20:37] Speaker 1: Sometimes you bring up shit.
[00:20:39] Speaker 2: And I really-
[00:20:39] Speaker 1: And I'm sure I'm bring up shit for you too. But-
[00:20:41] Speaker 2: I know, and I just wanna learn-
[00:20:42] Speaker 1: ... I just, like, not-
[00:20:42] Speaker 2: ... how to fight well.
[00:20:43] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:20:43] Speaker 2: And just be like, "I fucking-"
[00:20:45] Speaker 1: Fuck well.
[00:20:45] Speaker 2: "... can't stand you right now, and, like, I love you and we're gonna move through this." It's, like, even, like, I don't know, maybe I even say that in the midst of it, it's like, "Okay, you go into your cave, I love you, I'm gonna be here on the other side." But you-
[00:20:57] Speaker 1: We do.
[00:20:57] Speaker 2: I say sometimes when we're in conflict, and I'm like, "Okay, I love you, like, I'm here," and you're like ... Like-
[00:21:02] Speaker 1: Yeah, because I can feel-
[00:21:04] Speaker 2: (laughs)
[00:21:04] Speaker 1: I, I can't fully feel that you're saying it from, like, a resource place, it's like, it's from, like, an anxious place where-
[00:21:11] Speaker 2: But, but also, just picture, like, it's my fucking scared little girl.
[00:21:14] Speaker 1: I know.
[00:21:14] Speaker 2: It's not like, you know, it's not like, "Oh, Laurren's being so needy."
[00:21:17] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:21:17] Speaker 2: It's like, "Fuck, you think I'm enjoying this?" It's like, there is, like, a terrified little girl inside of me-
[00:21:22] Speaker 1: I know.
[00:21:23] Speaker 2: ... that's like-
[00:21:23] Speaker 1: And it takes me a while, like, you know, but, like, that's when I, I mean, when I'm in my cave, I realize all of that, and then I can come back with a lot of-
[00:21:30] Speaker 2: And not in a way where I want you to abandon your own process, but it's like, can we both soften a bit? Can I be less graspy and can you be like, "Okay-"
[00:21:39] Speaker 1: A little more...
[00:21:39] Speaker 2: "... she's not just, like, an emotionally abusive bitch who's trying to, like-"
[00:21:42] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:21:43] Speaker 2: "... break and enter into my cave because all she wants me to do is hold her?"
[00:21:47] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:21:47] Speaker 2: "And I can't take care of myself."
[00:21:48] Speaker 1: Yeah. So, like, this was, I mean, for me, it was really interesting that the thing that I've been wanting, and we were having conversations, conversations with Nick, and even with, through that, I was trying to allude, and I'm like, "Fuck, no." And it, it, I think, I don't even know if I said something different, but, like, the thing that I was wanting to be just validated and feeling like I'm not the o- only one doing, like, you know, like-
[00:22:11] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:22:11] Speaker 1: ... making up lies or lying, all these things, but that the situation is a little bit blown out of proportion.
[00:22:18] Speaker 2: Hmm. Mm-hmm.
[00:22:19] Speaker 1: Um, and I'm, I think I ... And that's been the thing that I've been holding onto this whole time.
[00:22:23] Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
[00:22:24] Speaker 1: And, and I'm like, "Fuck, it took, you know, this long to get here." So I don't know, sometimes it might just be one of those things where, like, it's just hard to understand how to access it.
[00:22:31] Speaker 2: Yeah, and like, and-
[00:22:32] Speaker 1: And what will happen if you open up to ...
[00:22:33] Speaker 2: Yeah, and like I said, I feel like I've, like, said it in ways, but not in a way that landed with you.
[00:22:38] Speaker 1: Yeah, it definitely hasn't landed. Mm-hmm.
[00:22:38] Speaker 2: Because I've talked to people about it outside of our relationship-
[00:22:41] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:22:41] Speaker 2: ... where I'm like, "Yeah, I know everything that's going on in here," is like, you know, there's, like, the tug that occurs, but I'm like, the degree of the way that it impacts me, I'm like, "I know that that is not about Ish." And I've, like, articulated that to many people.
[00:22:55] Speaker 1: Mm-hmm.
[00:22:55] Speaker 2: So it's not like I've been, like ... That has not crossed. That's, like, been there, but I just, yeah.
[00:23:00] Speaker 1: Yeah.
[00:23:01] Speaker 2: Haven't, wasn't able to articulate it in a way where you actually felt understood in your experience.
[00:23:08] Speaker 1: Okay.
[00:23:08] Speaker 2: Which makes sense.
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#relationship